198 | Girls5Eva Creator Meredith Scardino On How To Become INDISPENSABLE In A Writer's Room

Meredith Scardino has been many things: a fine artists, an animator, a late night writer, and now, a narrative comedy Creator/Showrunner (the wonderful Girls5Eva), but her focus on providing value wherever she is. Listen to Meredith take us through her twisted path to showrunning a Tina Fey-produced comedy and how she staffs her room.

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:

Lorien: Hey everyone, welcome back to The Screenwriting Life. I'm Lorien McKenna. Meg is not with us today because she is working on one of her projects. So it'll be just me and Jeff. And today we are excited to welcome Emmy Award winning writer and showrunner Meredith Scardino, who is the creator and showrunner of the amazing Girls 5 Eva.

She was the co executive producer on Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt, and she was also the executive producer on the interactive special Kimmy vs. The Red Friend. She has written for Late Night on The Colbert Report, for which she won four Emmys, three Writer's Guild Awards, and a Peabody. Congratulations.

That's very cool. She's written for Saturday Night Live, At Home with Amy Sedaris, The Late Show with Stephen Colbert, The Late Show with David Letterman, and of course, on Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt. Hi, Meredith.

Meredith: Hi. She sounds great. Whoever that lady is.

Jeff: It's very disembodying to hear your own bio. Well, we are thrilled to have you on Meredith.

Lorien and I are both huge Girls5eva nerds. So it's great to have you on.

Meredith: So nice to be here.

Jeff: Totally. We can't wait to dive into your experience in TV comedy. But before we do that, we're all going to be talking about our weeks or what we like to call adventures in screenwriting. Lorien, how was your week?

Lorien: Interesting. I got a lot of writing done and at the same time, not enough writing done. But the big event that happened this week is that my computer died while I was in the middle of a feature rewrite. It just like black screen.

Meredith: Do you know how it died? Did it, did it take its own life?

Lorien: Yes.

Meredith: Or did it?

Lorien: I think I was slowly killing it. Like I wasn't paying attention. So like the fan has been going off for a while. It stopped working unless it was plugged in. And I, I just never fully like I work on it and all these things will be happening. And then as soon as I closed it and walk away, I would forget like ADHD, menopause, brain, mom, brain, like anxiety denial.

I was just like, no, no. And then I wouldn't remember that it was a problem until I was working again, but this just like black screen, couldn't turn it on at all. I took it to the Apple store and we couldn't even jumpstart it. They like ran a diagnostic, barely dead battery. So then they were like, well, I hope you have all your data backed up.

I'm like, what?

Jeff: What percentage of people have ever said yes to that? Every single person is always no.

Lorien: This is my PSA. Please, right now, go get an external drive and back up all your data or put it on the cloud or something. Because I looked, I, I logged out of the cloud to see what I actually had there.

And it's like none of my recent stuff. And I was surprised at how I didn't panic about what I'd lost. Because when they place their battery, I guess they have to mess around with the motherboard. I could lose all the data, whatever. But I, I wasn't that freaked out because most of the stuff I have in there is old.

It's not like I'm going to go back and do anything with that stuff the only thing that I was a little bit sketched out about it was this rewrite that I was in the middle of, but I know what I want to do, so I will probably be better if I just reattack it, right, because I, I was halfway through the rewrite.

And so now I know what I want to do and probably make some better decisions moving forward to simplify it. So I'm really not that freaked out about it, which kind of freaks me out. Am I dead inside? Like my computer, or is it a legit, not a thing that I need to be worried about?

Meredith: Maybe you're just like confident in the, in the work.

Cause I have heard, and I forget who said this, but I have heard someone saying like, When they brainstorm, sometimes they're like, Oh, the stuff that I remember is probably the stuff I should write down anyway. Yeah. So You probably will remember like the filet of all the stuff. And then maybe it's also like a little bit of like Marie Kondo, cleaning out things that don't spark joy.

Lorien: Well, my organization system is not something to be proud of. So I'll be like, okay, I'll have a new chance to like, look at what I have and start fresh. But actually it does feel like a, okay, I'm starting a new era.

Meredith: Great.

Lorien: Here I go.

Meredith: Did you get, did you get a new computer? Because I feel like that is so, feels so good.

I love getting a new computer.

Lorien: Yes, but it was, I didn't, because it was a difference between 149 for a new battery and 1, 000 for a new computer. And I was like, you know what? Today, I'm going to try the battery and see if that works. So I've been using my daughter's computer, which has none of my passwords, none of my stuff.

So I feel behind a little bit. I'm muddling through. It's amazing. I remember I'm full Gen X, right? I'm resourceful as fuck. I will get this shit done no matter what. So it's happening. So that was, that took a big chunk of days. Oh, and I don't get my computer back for three to five days, so I'm a bit at loose.

Meredith: That's next week. Now you know what you're going to talk about next week, too. That's right.

Lorien: How I, I wrote, and my daughter's computer doesn't have final drafts, so I'm not quite sure what I'm going to do, but I will figure something out. Do some whiteboarding, maybe. Anyway, how was your week, Meredith?

Meredith: My week was great.

I, I just got back from the, from a festival. I've been packing my rolling suitcase and like hitting a variety of places. So I was in Austin for the ATX festival. Over the weekend and it was great. It was great. We, I did, we, they threw like a girls five of a karaoke night, which was really fun. It was all, fans of the show and all badge holders.

Like it's supposed to be the ATX festivals, like TV camp for adults. So if you love TV, if you want to learn how it's made, you got, you get a ticket for three day festival. And it was great. There was a, There was a woman there named Shelly who sang the Dawn Song of Fears, I'm afraid, like she did not consult the lyrics, like she knew them.

It was, it was really, and she had a beautiful voice. It was really wonderful. And they gave out all these pink cowboy hats that had a lit up, light up rim. So that was really fun. And then I...

Lorien: (...) did a feel like something you created and then it's become this iconic thing. Like things that came from your head now are like, it's, it lives in people's hearts.

Meredith: I'm like, so happy when anyone tells me they watched it and liked it, it, it like, it's a D a real dopamine hit. I gotta be honest.

Lorien: I bet.

Meredith: I just, I just I'm just really grateful. Like people take their time to watch it and. The things that they take from it. I, I always like to see what people liked or were like hit home for them or made them laugh really hard.

And then I did a panel with other showrunners. That was great. And then I got a mammogram this week. Nice. That was exciting. Thank you. And then I, around all that stuff, I I try to write, I try to get some stuff down on the page, but I've been doing the Pomodoro clock stuff, you know that?

Lorien: Yeah.

Meredith: Where you actually have a physical one. I have a physical one actually.

Lorien: Oh you do? So it's like a kitchen timer?

Meredith: It's like this. And, and my friend who has an office in the same place that I do, she also got me one, so now I have two. But yeah, you just set it for 20 minutes.

Lorien: Is that what, is that your standard?

Like 20 minutes?

Meredith: Like sometimes I, I, I try to just set it for 20 minutes just to get myself into it. Cause I, I tend to like, when I have. When I have like a, a project or a deadline, I, oh, there it's beeping because I turned it off. I tend to work like shrimp boat hours, like just really fully focused on it, but getting me to start is always hard.

So, this tends to jumpstart that process.

Lorien: Do you feel it helps when you have somebody else, like you said, you had a friend in the office, like some kind of accountability, like we're doing it now. Right. So that it feels like there's some connection, like some kind of accountability.

Meredith: I think so for sure.

And then also the thing that I love the most are deadlines. I am very deadline oriented. I think there are friends. I they're certainly my friend. So I like a deadline and not a deadline. I like half. No, it's Self imposed one time my friend and I were talking about this might've been her idea that I just loved this Marlena who worked at Kimmy Schmidt, she was, we were talking about could you hire like a dog, the bounty hunter type person that basically just drains your finances when you, when you fail to reach the thing that you said that you were going to do.

Lorien: So I I've set a goal for myself to deliver new pages to my manager. Every Friday. And if I don't meet it, I have to donate 50 to something I find really reprehensible.

Meredith: Oh God. Are you funding, just funding I haven't heard packs right now.

Lorien: I have not missed a deadline yet because real stakes punitive, right?

Like Punitive stakes, which I need, it works for me.

Meredith: They work for me too.

Lorien: Yeah. I told my family, I told everyone on the show and it was everyone was like, you're going to go right. Right. So I've been, I've involved everyone else in these stakes because it's upsetting if I have to do this.

Meredith: That's great. That's public shame is also good. These are all motivators.

Lorien: Public shame, disappointing other people. Totally. Yeah. Well, it sounds like you had a good week. So you're working on something new.

Meredith: I'm just trying to get the engine started on like longer range things, just to try to start it up again.

I've been very focused on Girls5eva and obviously I hope to do more. In the time between I'm like,

Lorien: Yeah.

Meredith: Just trying to open my eyes to other things, get them started. They take things take forever.

Lorien: I think that was really hard for me to wrestle. So I ran a show that was like all consuming, right?

For me, it was first time I was a showrunner. So it was like all in everything. And I was panicked a little, but 15 minutes a day I had that wasn't focused on the show about I'm not generating anything new because I just didn't have the energy. And I talked to a lot of showrunners and what they all said is we have to find the time to do that.

Yes. Right. You can't fully. And I was like, how am I supposed to do that? And I realized that it's that all in mentality that it wasn't serving me. So like, how do you manage that?

Meredith: I am going to talk to you about how to manage it because it sounds like you know how to do it because I am very much that's something that I certainly struggle with.

I jump in with two feet. As under I just go for the thing that I'm working on and I, I do find it hard to switch gears. So I'm, I'm always impressed with people that have nine things going at once. And I'm always asking them like, how do you do it? What are you doing? How are you doing it?

So I'm going to ask you, how are you doing it?

Lorien: I ha I don't know. I haven't run a show since then. Right. So I haven't been able to put it to the test, but I have to reprioritize like every day, depending on those deadlines or what could potentially get me a job. Right. Cause I could be working on something and then something comes up as an opportunity and then I have to re jigger my schedule.

And that is really hard for my brain.

Meredith: Yeah. Mine too. I, well, because the brain, it's a lie that we're great multitaskers. It's a total lie. The brain, that's not a real thing. We just jump. Relax.

Jeff: Yeah. Yeah.

Meredith: But I do think, I do think one of the, just Pomodoro wise I don't know if I'm being very much paid by the Pomodoro industry to promote their products.

Lorien: It's not a paid advertisement,

Meredith: I am surprised sometimes, but. If your brain thinks you need a gazillion hours to do the things you want to do, and sometimes you'd be surprised if you focused for a short period and not put a lot of pressure on it. Yes. You'd be like, wait a minute. I, I did that in, like the other day, I, okay, this is, the other day I was like hanging something in my office and I set, I set my timer for 10 minutes and I'm like, I'm not going to deal with this after 10 minutes, this stupid map of the Catskills I'm trying to hang and, and, and a bulletin board.

I'm like, I'm just going to set it for 10 minutes. And I did it. I did both within three minutes. But normally that would just sit on my to do list and I'd be like, Oh, I'll do it later. I'll do it later.

Lorien: I get super overwhelmed. I've talked about it on the show a lot. I have ADHD and like I haven't, I had my room, my bedroom painted a year ago and I still still haven't hung pictures up yet, because it seems like I'm going to do it wrong.

Like somehow the stakes are so high around this very silly thing. Like I can move the pictures around. And it's the same thing then with my writing, like even just digging in to I'm gonna pull up a document. I'm going to start writing. And then once I get into it though, I lose five hours. I have the best time.

Right? It's just that clicking into it.

Meredith: So much is getting started.

Lorien: Yeah. Yeah.

Meredith: And that book, that book War of Art is always like super helpful when you're really feel stuck because you see everything as resistance. And then you realize like just how much you're being a weasel. Trying to avoid doing the thing that you love and are good at, but like getting into it is really hard sometimes.

Lorien: So I was weaseling about getting my computer fixed. Yeah, we're all weasels. Because I didn't want to confront the fact that I might need a computer, a new one, or I was just so yeah, anyway. Jeff, how was your week?

Jeff: I, I can eat it fast. I, a little peek behind the curtain, Meredith. We are launching a new sort of membership community for fans of our podcast.

So, little tease, if you're listening, we're very excited about it. But I've been doing a lot of editing for the show, like little promos and Megan Lorien, and I feel like it's been interesting for me to I'm, I'm a writer as well, but I feel like my writing's been a little bit on the backseat just as we're launching this community because it's a big launch.

But it, it's a reminder of the value of creativity even outside of our context as writers. It can be very I think healthy for your brain to make things even if it's not exactly typing on the page. So I've had a lot of fun just cutting these promos. Cooking in graphics and feeling like I can be creative in a way that's not necessarily like my writer brain screaming at me, speaking of deadlines, about other things I want to be getting done.

So, I think just for our listeners, if you're, don't forget to create creative space for other areas of your life to sometimes just refresh your artist spirit, as it were.

Meredith: I also love walking around, like just taking walks and things come into your head,

Jeff: So are you based in New York, Meredith?

Meredith: I am based in New York

Jeff: I'm Upper West right now as I speak.

Oh Yeah, and I agree Columbus is or I'm saying Columbus cuz I live in Columbus Avenue New York is such a walking city. I feel like going outside It is just like you're getting smacked with inspiration more than LA. I would say having lived in both

Lorien: I just get smacked with allergies when the Santa Ana's coming through.

Jeff: That's LA.

Lorien: The wind is our major weather these days. So

I wanted to talk to you about your, I read that you started in animation.

Meredith: I did.

Lorien: So I, after I was a playwright, I went into animation as well. So I'm just wondering like what you did in animation, why you were drawn to that and then how it translated to late night.

Meredith: Yeah. So let's see. When I was a kid I was very, art into art.

Like I took all the art classes I could possibly take. It's like one of those things like, oh, you can draw. And I also loved it. I loved cartoons. I loved drawing all the time, so I took. All the art classes. I, I took I saw like my first naked people and drawing, drawing classes.

Like live drawing, drawing, live drawing at Moore College of Art when I was like 16. Nice. I was drawing nude models and was really on the fine art track. I went to RISD for a summer in high school and then I applied as a fine art major to college. I went to Cornell for, for, I got my like BFA in painting and then I moved to New York to go to grad school.

I went to Parsons. For painting as well. And when I was at Parsons....

Lorien: You met Tim Gunn?

Meredith: Yeah. Tim Gunn . Yeah. Yeah. And then, and then that started my Tim Gunn era . I yeah, I, the first writing class, I'll tell you, I got into writing partially because one of.

First classes I took you, I got to take electives at the new school when I was at Parsons. So one one university. And I took a, a writing class and by this teacher, Sue Shapiro, and I, Really, really liked it. I, I, it was like sort of short form essays, sketch, whatever. And that really encouraged me to start taking class, like writing classes at UCB or the pit or wherever.

And simultaneously, I was also taking improv classes at UCB and the pit and other places, magnet theater. And so I met a bunch of funny weirdos. That I felt very connected to. And and all the while, this is all like, there was all things going on at the same time. Once I got to New York, basically, I feel like it was like the Wizard of Oz.

My life was in color. I loved, I loved college. It was great, it was pretty rural and, I played a sport and I was I don't know, when I got to New York, I was just, I It's Oh my gosh, there's so many things I can do here that are so interesting. All these worlds I loved that I didn't know how you even got into.

And so I started to make money on the side. This is very circuitous answer, but to make money on the side, I, I learned flash animation at the time. It was right around, it was turn of the century and I learned flash animation and I realized you I learned Flash to design websites for people for money on the side.

And then I realized, I was like, Oh my God, you can animate with this. So I started making animations. Then I started seeking out animators to work for. My first job in animation was like doing digital shorts for Bill Plimpton. If you remember him, he was like, he's like a very prolific, still working, amazing, independent animator.

And then I made some shorts for, I was fully self taught. I didn't. I didn't take a class ever in animation. So it was janky, like it's, it's, it's didn't look amazing. Like it looked good. It's fine, but it was very, had its own style. And and then it was your voice. Yeah. And then I, I ended up doing shorts for comedy central.

I was hired as the animator and they had a commitment of 10 shorts. They were going to do on this. It's a little short piece called Rick Shit List, starring the voice of Jake Foglenist. And they had five written. And then I think the next five that came in, they didn't love or something. And from the writer and I said, Hey, what about these?

And I had written a bunch. So they let me do a couple.

Lorien: Have you already written them? Or did you hear that they didn't like them and then go home and write them?

Meredith: I think I felt there was like an opportunity and then I seized on it. And then I, but they didn't, no one asked me. And then I came in and I was like, Whoa, what about these?

I have a bunch of other ones. And they said, yeah, this is great. So I just. Got encouraged that way too. So I was and in the meantime, I met a writer. I met a friend and we became writing partners. We were trying to pitch. We were trying to do everything. We were trying to pitch reality shows. We were going to he had interned at ESPN classics.

So we got invited into these like ESPN brainstorming meetings where they would just give you free bagels and take your ideas. And we were thrilled to be there and give them anything we had. Yeah, exactly.

Lorien: How all writers start.

Meredith: Yes. And then there were all these different people there from different parts of ESPN, and one of the the people that were there, two of the people that were there were Gary Belsky and Neil Klein, who were the editors of the magazine.

And they heard I was a cartoonist animator and they said, Hey, we're actually looking for a cartoon for the magazine. So then Ben and I were like, we'll do it. So I, we would come up with ideas and then I would draw them. And we did that for a while. And then eventually we were. Both needed to get jobs and I met somebody at VH1 when I was Through improv, I was doing improvised ads for the show Scare Tactics.

Jeff: Awesome. I remember that show.

Meredith: Do you remember that show? Oh yeah. And one of the guys there was this guy named Brett and he, he, worked at VH1. And I said, Hey, my writing partner and I just wrote, we're trying to do an SNL packet. We just wrote a sketch. about VH1. They were all those, I love the 80s shows.

So we did a, we had written a sketch called, I really love the 80s. And it was all these Mike Lee and black style panelists, but they were talking about all the horrible things that happened in the 80s, but in the same tone Reagan being shot and et cetera. So, I gave it to him just on a lark, just gave it to him and it got passed around, around VH1 and people were emailing it to each other. And then I was like, Hey, do you have any jobs? We, we need jobs. And so Ben and I both got jobs at VH1. I got a job at Best Week Ever. And Ben got a job as a story editor on Driven the music celebrity documentary series. So that's how, that's That's the long answer of how art turned to writing.

Lorien: What I love about this is that you were prepared, right? Like you didn't, weren't waiting for somebody to be like, I pick you or could you do this? It was like , but there's this like fearlessness when we're young, right? Yeah. They were just like, I'll do that thing. I did that thing already. Here's the thing I did.

Right? Yeah. I, I think a lot of creative people are so worried about, am I allowed to, am I good enough? Right. Those voices in our head. And it's sort of like channel your 10 year old self, your 10 year old self would be like, I'm going to write that thing and then I'm going to give it to somebody, joyful.

And it's like a relief you've solved someone's problem.

Meredith: That's a nice way of putting it. Yeah. Yeah. I also think just. Being okay with rejection is a major part of success. My dad, I still, I have a very distinct memory of my dad telling me, I was on the phone with him when I was at I was doing shorts at Comedy Central.

I don't know what I was doing. But I was trying to do something. And he got, and he, he started his career like as an insurance salesman. And he told me like what it would take, how many calls it took to get anyone to actually listen. And then how many of those calls it took to get anyone to meet him in person.

And then how many of those calls it took of all the people that met him in person to actually sign up for an insurance policy. And it was astronomical. But the only way to get there. Was to get to hear the no over and over and over again. So he was just like, just keep, so I, I tried to take that advice best as best I could and just be like, your rejection is just part of it.

Lorien: What was a really painful rejection you got?

Meredith: Not getting a job or just any, any career thing.

Lorien: Yeah. You can tell me about your personal life.

Meredith: I got let go from when I, I got let go from Letterman when I was a writer there after a year and a half. And I was. upset. Yeah. But rejection. I, oh, initially when I applied to grad school, I got rejected from so many grad school. I got rejected like everywhere I first applied and then I had to reapply the next year and then I got into Parsons.

Lorien: I got rejected from Tisch. Oh, you did? All I wanted to do was live in New York when I was 27.

That's all I wanted to do. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I didn't go to grad school until a little bit later, but I got rejected. And I was like, Oh, but I didn't. reapply, right? I applied somewhere else, but I wish that I had I decided where I wanted to go and what I wanted to do. I wish I had a little more perseverance to really go after that.

Obviously I don't, cause it all worked out, but yeah.

Meredith: It worked out you ended up where you needed to end up.

Lorien: Yes. But I, I'm envious of that, that you had where it was like, this is what I'm going to do. And I'm going to keep going for it. And I don't know, envious, admire. I admire that you did that.

How about that? That's nice. Yes. I admire that you did that.

Meredith: It's also, by the way, typical youngest child behavior, like who the heck is sending their, helping send their kid to like art school. It's it's definitely the youngest child. I'm the oldest. You're the oldest. Different. Different. My oldest sister is a lawyer.

And so she's the, the one they're like, she's all right.

Lorien: The third one will let her, she can just a feral do whatever they want to get her out of the house.

Meredith: Happy if she like took the trash out. That's a win.

Lorien: So you made the transition to late night and you worked on some amazing shows and you won a bunch of awards, which is like amazing.

So here's my big question around this. Where do you keep your Emmys?

Meredith: Okay. I great question. So I moved in to an apartment. In 2020 that has built ins, which by the way, has always been like some, there's a couple of things I feel like are in my head. I'm like, it's a sign of making it. Here's what they are. A dresser that has like the soft clothes drawer where it finishes the job for you.

I have always wanted that. I always wanted a built in bookcase, a king bed. And twin sinks in the primary bathroom. I do not have twin sinks, but the rest have, have somehow come true. I'm still in a rental, but you can't have it all, but, but so the built ins I have an Emmy in there.

And Writers Guild Awards, but there's something about the height of the, of the of the, the book shelf that only one of the Emmys fits. Like it was short, shorter that year.

Happening shorter or something than other Emmys. So my, I have three other ones that are in a closet cause I can't. Display them or fit them.

Lorien: That's awesome. I love that. It's just the one that fits

Meredith: there's, it's the one that fits, but also it feels like I don't like looking at them all the time. Like I, I know this guy.

There's a guy, a really, really funny guy, Eric Drysdale. I don't know if you know him, but I worked with him at. The Colbert report and he before the Colbert report had worked at the Daily Show. So that guy's got so many Emmys and he keeps them in a closet. He's I don't like them glaring at me as I'm trying to write something new.

It's too much pressure.

Lorien: I was going to ask you, right? You've won these awards for outstanding writing and comedy, right? And your, your late night career is so amazing. And you've gotten to work on, develop so much hilarious stuff. And I know late night is a grueling, grueling experience, right? That turnaround of jokes and everything.

What do you do when you have a day when you just don't feel funny?

Meredith: Well, I think every single person that works on a day, a show that goes out daily knows how to write without inspiration. Like it's just, it's, it's. you're there to do a job. You're not waiting for some, an angel whisper, the perfect bit in your ear.

You, that's actually, that's, that's one of the things I learned at Letterman was to kill the preciousness of anything and just be like, all right, I'm here to churn out a gazillion jokes in a day and, and then do it tomorrow and do it, do it the next day. And there's a freedom in knowing that, you get something on, you get a bunch of stuff on one day.

Or you don't and you're disappointed, then you always have tomorrow. And that's great. That's a really nice. gift of being able to be part of a daily show. But I do think and also these staffs are big for a reason because you have a lot of material to generate. And so you don't ever want it just to be all one person's shoulders.

It's like too much pressure and it's just not possible. Like you just can't do it. You really need help. You really need a lot of help to, to get. To get the show up each day.

Lorien: So then how did you transition to scripted? It was something you wanted to do? Was it something that Maybe the presented itself?

Meredith: It's, to be honest, it's, I always wanted to just work at the funny place, like I, with people that I would die to make laugh. And so Stephen Colbert was one of those people that I was like, he's a genius. He's amazing. Like I'd kill to work there. And I worked for him for six years.

And I still wish I worked with him every day. He's wonderful. And, but then I read, I was a really big fan. Who isn't of Tina Fey and and Robert Carlock from 30 rock. And I heard they were working on a new project for Netflix. Well, actually it wasn't for Netflix at the time, but it was, I heard they were working on a new project and I got to read the pilot that they had written and at the time it was called Tooken and that's what the Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt show was called at the time and I read it and it was so exciting to me.

I just, all I wanted to do is be part of helping make it. And so it was really cool. It wasn't so much that I was like, had a foot out the door or anything like that at Colbert. I knew at a certain point I wanted to have different writing experiences, write for different characters just, in over the course of my career.

But I didn't jump at anything until I read that. And then, and then I just. Went for it. And they said yeah, can work on the show. So that's how I, that's how I jumped over there.

Lorien: Did you have like a half hour sample?

Meredith: I had a half hour sample that was very dusty and old that I had written.

So here's what happened. I had, after I got let go from the contract, not renewed at Letterman I. Wrote an original pilot called or no, I actually I have a backwards. So after that happened I was like trying to get out there I was I realized I probably needed to write a pilot or something like that.

I was also working on other Packets for late night shows like I was just doing all kinds of things right before the writer strike happened of 2007. I want to say the night before, I submitted a packet for the Colbert report. I heard they were looking for a writer. They put out a, APB for packets.

So I submitted and I, and then the writer's strike happened and I thought, well, that just, Might as well have been thrown into the Grand Canyon. That's not, but also I was used to things just, you, you write stuff, you just don't hear back or you hear you got close and you didn't get it.

Like I was very used to that kind of rejection. I just thought there was no way that was going to happen. And so over the course of the four month strike, you're allowed to write stuff on spec, but I, no one was hiring me to do anything obviously, cause it was during the strike, but I wrote an original pilot.

And it was called wild man. It was very 30 rock, but for people that were making like a wildlife show, like David Attenborough yeah, it was fun. It was really fun to write. I finished it. And then I was like, all right, I guess this is my sample. And then the strike was over and I got a phone call from the go bear for asking, to come in for an interview and I got the job.

So, so the pilot that Tina and my manager just submitted that even though it was real dusty and, and, it was six years old or seven years old or something by the time Robert and Tina read it, there's enough jokes there that they, felt like they were willing to meet me.

Jeff: Did you have aspirations before that Colbert call to possibly get a meeting to work on 30 Rock? Was that kind of the hope?

Meredith: Well, It's interesting.

Jeff: It's a full circle.

Meredith: Yeah. When I, okay, when I first, there were a couple little rumblings of potentially working on 30 Rock, but the timing was always weird.

One was, Right when I first got the Colbert Report, I heard they were looking for someone and my manager was asking me if he wanted, if I wanted to throw my hat in the ring and I was like, no, I'm, I'm happy here. I'd like, while I loved that show so much, if it was really meaningful to me to work at the Colbert Report at Job that I loved going to every day and I just felt like I don't want to leave within the year I started like I just, I wasn't, it wasn't about like just advancing advancing I loved it I wanted to learn from being there and then the second time I heard they were looking for someone was, I think, The back half of their final of their final season, and I was still in the throat like I was kind of like, well, I don't want to necessarily just leave to be there for five months and then, and then be, it probably would have helped me get something else, but I, but again, I was happy, but then I felt like the timing of Kimmy Schmidt was really perfect because, I wasn't sure how much longer the Colbert I didn't know about the late The late show move for Steven yet.

So I, I was just. Every time they would renew their contract, I always wondered if they were going to keep doing it or not, if he was going to keep doing it, if the daily show was going to keep doing it. And I didn't know how much longer he wanted to play the character. So I thought I loved the script so much.

It felt maybe like the right time to go for it. And it was like, yeah, there was like so many exciting, like I wanted to write for women too. Like I wanted to write other types of. characters and I loved it so it was so hard to leave but it felt like it, it really helped me mature a lot and spread my wings as a writer.

That sounded so cheesy like a Hallmark card. I'm sorry.

Lorien: Another career. There you go. Yeah.

Meredith: Oh yeah. Greeting cards. That's where the money is.

Lorien: So far you've done advertising, greeting cards. What else do you want to do? We'll put it out there. Yeah. When did you come up with the idea for Girls5Eva?

Meredith: So after, let's see, it was, it was after we did the interactive special, I believe.

And, I pitched it in 2019 in the fall. Who did you pitch it to? What does that look like? Pitch to a bunch of streamers. I probably pitched seven or eight places. In one week. And, at the, I had, so I came up with the idea. I, I was, I would just, I was I can't remember the exact timing, but I remember being, I used to go to this which I highly recommend for any writers in New York this place called the writers room.

I, I would work there a lot when I really felt like I needed to focus because it's silent. So you can't talk. You're not really, you're supposed to have your phone on airplane mode or off. And so it's really a very, it's a great place to focus. The other thing I love about it is that everyone looks really stressed out and they're all working at cubicles and you just like, Oh, if I think I have the weight of the world on myself, look at that.

lady over there who looks like she's about to die. So it, it was, I was there, I was there and I was thinking a lot about what kind of show I wanted to develop. And if I had, if I got the opportunity to, and so I came up with it. in that place. And then I brought it to Tina Fey and Robert Carlock and pitched it to them, pitched them the rough, very rough broad strokes of the characters and generally what the show is about.

And knowing like part of the reason why I thought I could pitch it to is because we had Jeff, the amazing genius, Jeff Richmond, who does, does all the music for, 30 rock, Kimmy Schmidt, Mean Girls musical. He can do any genre, worked at SNL, Second City, anyway. So having him involved felt like a necessary ingredient in, in being able to pull off, it being like a viable girl group.

So then we, they liked it. And then we all decided that the best move was that I should just write the pilot so that, so basically I wrote the pilot. And so when we would pitch it afterward, I would leave behind the pilot. So I'd do the whole pitch and then afterward I'd say, okay, and if you want to know here's the pilot episode.

So it was, I liked that a lot because I, I always think like when you pitch something, everybody, everybody gets their own idea of maybe what the execution is and I was a first time showrunner and you don't know like exactly how I write or so it left no confusion as to what it was. That's great.

You leave it behind.

Lorien: I've heard people, I've pitched a lot, right? And I've only ever pitched to get hired to write the pilot. I've never come in with a written pilot. And part of that is because, it's this idea that well, the executives want to like work on it with you. And if you write the pilot, then it's this narrow, narrow window and you're not going to get the chance.

But I, I've been rethinking this to your point, which is, this is what I can do reframing it in a positive way. I'm the only one who can do the execution. And that you're not saying this is the final forever. You're still going to get notes. Right. If they buy the show. Yeah. Of course. You get notes.

Yeah. But it's, I think it's just a different way to think about it in terms of, cause I'm, I have a pitch right now and I'm like, should I write the pilot? Should I? And then I'm like, I might as well.

Meredith: I mean, you've got to do the free work. It's, it's, it's also like sometimes if you have an idea that is very obvious, it's, how maybe it would get executed, or it's just such a good, easy nugget to pitch.

And maybe you have talent attached, whatever. Like I didn't have any talent attached. I had Tina Fey attached as a EP, which was incredibly helpful.

Lorien: A little bit.

Meredith: I recommend it. Would recommend. So that was. That was really, what I had really going for me there.

Lorien: So when Peacock, right?

Peacock bought the show originally. What was the thing you did to celebrate when you got the news? And was it a development deal or was it a season pickup? It was a straight to series. Awesome. So what did you like?

Meredith: I can't remember where I was when I heard. What? Can you believe that? You just blacked out.

I might have blacked out. Oh, I ran to Cincinnati. We're in Cincinnati. That's so perfect for that show though. No, I I don't remember. I got a phone call from my agent and he said, it looks like it was always like a little bit of it looks like.

Lorien: Yeah, you never get the it's not like "you're in business!"

Meredith: Yeah. And then you're like, yeah, you're like, yeah. It's very clenched waiting. I hope. Yeah.

Lorien: They're talking about doing it with you. And I'm like, what is that? Did I sell it? Like it's always this vague hedgy.

Meredith: And I tend to feel like, I don't know if this is a great way to live or not. Someone, a psychologist could tell me, but I feel like I don't.

I don't pre celebrate. I, I, cause I feel like things blow up.

Lorien: Yes. And nothing is real.

Meredith: Nothing is real.

Lorien: even, even when you have a straight to series and you get the money coming in and like the dealer, you're like, you show up for the first day of the writer's room and you're like, people are coming, right?

Meredith: Yeah. It's real.

Lorien: The writers I hired are going to show up and you guys are actually happening.

Meredith: Right. Yeah. Yeah. Finding somewhere in the middle where you're like, Able to celebrate how far you've come and what you've done, but also not be or attempt fate tempate or, or just be naive about how things work.

Because a lot of, there's a lot of talk of things happening all the time.

Lorien: Oh yeah.

Meredith: And, I mean we all know people that tell you that, oh, I've got this thing it's going to be huge and then you've never, it just doesn't exist. Yeah. I don't even know what happened to it.

Lorien: So you were a first time showrunner.

Yeah. And you have to staff a room now. So a lot of our audience are TV writers who want to get staffed. Like we've talked a lot about on the show, like the writer's room math and you don't have to be perfect at everything, but what are you looking for when you're reading and meeting with writers?

Meredith: Okay. I, well. Listen, every, right, every show and showrunner is different and so the needs of various showrunners completely vary. So this is just my experience, but I was trying to write the funniest show I could possibly deliver. And so it was, Very important to me that if I was reading someone's script, it was funny,

So I....

Lorien: Did you laugh out loud? Were you like, oh, I laughed out loud, or I did a rum.

Meredith: I, yeah, I like, I rum .

Lorien: That's that thing you do where you're like, huh? Yeah.

Meredith: Yeah. I always looked for just things that felt alive. And felt like there was a point of view felt front footed felt.

I hate, when someone if don't do a lot of typos that's a turnoff. If you know if I'm taking if. A lot of people say this I'm going to take the time to read your script, like you should take the time to read your script and not have a million spelling errors and, and sentences with no punctuation.

So, I also really like when I hear you hear about people, Oh, that person's good in a room. Like you hear. When you, when you get a recommendation from someone you trust, I think is incredibly valuable. And in some ways, like one of the most valuable things, because you're, because they were in a room with them.

It's I also, certain things, certain subject matters when you read people's scripts, if they are, seem interested in similar territory, it, it feels, Oh, they'd be like, I remember season one. I read a script by Chelsea Devonta's who ended up being a writer on season one. She wrote a, a pilot that was very similar in premise.

It was about a fallen pop star and kind of picking up the mess of life and all that. And I was like, Oh, well, wow. That's, That's such similar territory. I've talked to her and she also has a podcast at the time. It was called celebrity book club. Now it's called glamorous trash, but she had read every like female memo.

Yeah. It's all about celebrity memoirs, mostly women, 99. 9 percent women. And. She knew everything about oh, from Jessica Simpson's memoir, from Britney, just, she just knew so much. I was like, wow, this person is an asset to have in the room. Even if she was a terrible writer, that would just be like incredibly helpful.

But she wasn't, right? But she's not. No, she's really funny. And she was, she was a great writer. She was really funny. And so, but just as far as just like idea generation so helpful so that that was just like minded. You can't always match up your content to the show you're applying to obviously, but if you're choosing between let's say, let's say it's like you're writing a post apocalyptic.

Trying to get on a post apocalyptic show and you have a post apocalyptic sample, you might in your head say, Oh God, does this seem too similar? Maybe I should send something different. It's no, send it or send both because it'll just be like, Oh, I hadn't thought about, about this thing. That's really helpful.

I think when you're meeting people I'm also looking for people who come in to an interview with ideas and seem just generally excited about the show, because so much is about being enthusiastic about the show that you're writing. You sit in a room together and it's just constant idea generation.

So you want people that feel like they're going to contribute a lot, and even just want to talk about the subject matter how it, how it, they relate to it. Oh, this, this character reminds me of my dad or whatever it is. So, and also you're wondering, do you know when you're in a writer's room, you're together a lot.

And so you're also wondering, is this somebody. That I want to spend 12 hours a day with or however long you're together. And, if you have a ton of negative energy, it's going to impact the room. So I, I, I look for people that are very improv, yes, Andy, and feel like they're contributing generally like love the and know that you're making it together.

It's not any one person's, everybody in especially the comedy world, there's always a name attached to a script. But it's all, it's a weird misnomer. I think, I don't know one comedy doesn't have everyone's paws on it.

Lorien: Like it's a girl. Yeah. You break it in the room. You, you may outline it in a room and some shows even scripted in the room.

Yeah. Like line by line.

Meredith: Yeah. We, we certainly have done that plenty. It's hard on zoom, but when you're in a room together in person, it's a little bit easier, but. Absolutely. It feels so much to me more like the way, how all the writers in Late Night get credited every episode. That feels Like what it is, I, yeah, you just look for invested people, invested, excited people that are funny and smart.

I also like people that have interesting backgrounds that maybe didn't go right from college, right into a writer's room. Like I think a lot of people bring a lot of interesting life experience to rooms too. And. Yeah. I know a lot of writers sometimes feel like, Oh, I changed careers and now I feel like I'm behind.

I'm like, no, that's an asset. Like just being a, a TV major in college and going, going right into a room if you can do it. Great. But I think it's cool to be like, okay, whatever I worked on a, a shrimp boat, shrimp boat. I worked on a shrimp boat for eight months. Interesting,

Lorien: I think what's so amazing about talking to you is that there I'm allowing my brain to shift into seeing the positive side of things in a way, right.

That I think is really great for our audience in terms of, there are a lot of things we as writers tell ourselves, I'm too old. It's too late for me. I wrote a show exactly like that crap. Now my, now my. Yes. That pilot is dead. Right? Like all these reasons we tell ourselves, it's not going to work out. So, I shouldn't write the pilot because then I'm limiting my options.

All these things were so inclined to do, but maybe flipping it and reframing it. So it was like, how does this serve me? How can I make this work for me in a way so that it's not a negative, but it's more of a plus. Yeah. It's really hard for writers to do.

Meredith: Well, I, sometimes that I always try to do, and it's really hard, but I try to remember that everything's start, like everything started somehow in some way, a million things fail.

And yes, the odds of your project happening might be, Everything that did happen started with an idea. Everything that felt inevitable started with somebody with an idea. And it didn't, to them, feel inevitable at the time. So, it's if you don't do it, It's you, then, it won't happen,

Lorien: right? That's, but that's part of it too, right?

Fear of success is the same thing as fear of failure in a way, right? That's weird tangle. So what advice would you give to emerging or recently staffed or beginning writers who want to be a showrunner?

Meredith: Well, I would say some of the things that I think make you incredibly indispensable in a room is there's this feeling when you're the showrunner that you're like, no one cares about this as much as I do.

Cause they don't. It's just not possible. It's like almost impossible because you go home at night and it's on your shoulder. Like you feeling all of it. It's. It's. You're just living it. You're just in it. And I think when you feel like there's people that go home at night, remembering the things we didn't figure out or anticipating the problems coming down the road, it is so helpful. It's so helpful. And it really helps the showrunner be like, Oh my gosh, this person's thinking like a showrunner. They're thinking about, okay, we haven't cracked this character arc or what could go with this story. Okay. We'll see. Bye guys. We'll figure it out tomorrow.

But it's Somebody that goes home and has, has a pitch, even if it's not the perfect pitch in the morning, you're like, they were thinking about it. It's so nice. Like even just going into rewrite feeling like they're paying attention to what was doing well in the. In the table read and what wasn't so that it doesn't feel like a shocker when we're rewriting this one scene and they're like, Oh, I had an idea for that.

Just trying to think ahead is so helpful. And then it like it totally puts that person on your radar. Some people will notice if you if you are helping the showrunner solve their problems, they will 100 percent notice and they won't want you to go anywhere except where they are. So, and then I think, of the things that The Strike really fought for is trying to make sure writers are getting set experience, because I think it is incredibly important. I was very fortunate to have a lot of set experience on Kimmy Schmidt and other, shows I've worked on because production and writing overlapped.

And so you could go to have a set, work with actors. And Now, I think there's a new rule that two people at least need to be through the production paid through the entire production. I think even through edit, is that right?

Lorien: Yes.

Meredith: Yeah. I think it's all the way through post. It's very, very good because I think being part of the post process is Is such a learning experience that you don't really always get a, an eye on and it, it just shows you, like when I, when I was a writer that was not in post, I was always pushing for something I just found so funny, but I wasn't always wonder, I wasn't always thinking about, does it serve the engine of the plot?

Does it, is it, is it, Aligning with character drives because those things stick out in post they, they are actually road bumps. And so you understand why they get cut once you're in there too. And Tina's very, very good at identifying those things. And she has taught me a lot and Robert too.

They've taught me a lot about making sure this dumb bit you've wanted to do forever lines up with a character's drive. Otherwise it's like it just, it just sits there and sticks out. It might be funny isolated on a clip, but within the within the episode, it, it, the audience will get bored. So those kinds of things, I think trying to get your button edit also just asking.

Your show runner, if you can shadow them and edit, if you can, whatever, however you feel like you can be helpful. The one thing that's not that helpful is being like, can I take you to lunch and pick your brains? And that's just, that's just no, me helping you, without you it's, Those are, I'm sure I've had my fair share of asking people to do that in the past.

Lorien: Never send me an email asking to pick my brain. I need all my brains. I don't need anyone picking at that.

Meredith: Yeah if you can be helpful, that's, that's what it is. It's being helpful, being not being in the room being on. I'm always late. This is my, this is my Achilles heel is my lateness.

I'm my run late and everyone else should be on time. So if you are a late person like myself, you better show up with pitches. That's why I always make that was the deal. I made myself. I'm like, If I walk in, I don't talk about why I'm late. I don't, I don't get into a long story about why I'm late, which takes up more time.

I sneak in and I just start pitching my face off. And then it's Well, she brought a lot to the table. Yeah. It's if you have a deficit that you know is a problem, just combat offset, do some offset to make yourself indispensable. That's funny.

Lorien: I'm habitually really early and on time. Okay.

And so when I have a meeting or in a room, like if people are late, it makes me like grind my teeth because that's my thing. And I say it right up front. I need you guys to be here good time, right? Because otherwise like a train,

Meredith: you're like the train's going to leave. Yes. And I'm never late for a train because I know it'll leave.

That's right. I am the last to leave. I'm yes, I never leave. Once I'm there,

Lorien: which is why running a show is like being beaten to death with your own dreams. Oh, that's beautiful. No, that's it. That that's exactly what it is.

Meredith: That's a good premise for a movie.

Lorien: Yeah. So Jeff, did you have a question?

Jeff: Yeah. It's funny. If you talked about that balance between story and joke writing, especially that sticks out in post. It's funny. It feels like everything feels magnified in post in a way. A great joke will play even funnier. It's like those small decisions you make on the page kind of like are under a magnifying glass once you get to the edit.

But I, I would love to hear, I feel like the Tina Fey, Robert Carlock universe is so joke heavy and so joke dense. He talked about that tightrope between we want to pack as many jokes per page as we can, but we do have to tell a story here. What does that negotiation look like in the room?

And what are you thinking about as the showrunner as you're encountering that?

Meredith: Yeah, it's definitely a balance. It's definitely one of those things where, you're like, Tina will often, she'll often call herself like the fun police a little bit. 'cause I'll, I'll just have like way too much, she'll be like, you, you know that thing of look in the mirror, take two things off , right.

Lorien: Right.

Meredith: Coco Chanel, right. Coco Chanel who said that? That was the original, yeah.

Jeff: Yes.

Meredith: I don't know if she's. hero, but the yeah, that, that thing of realizing when you've tipped it too far and because you really need the story, you need to be able to follow the story. You need the characters to just to, to feel what they care about.

And so the joke always must serve those. that thing or else it has, it just really goes. You, there's room oftentimes for a little downbeat when someone's entering. That's like a joke that's thrown away. That's really mean anything. And it's just funny. But but then when the scene really starts, you need to be like in the pocket of the drive, the characters drives and, and keep your characters active.

And the jokes need to come like hanging on those vines, and, and if the premise, if the, if there's a bit that's absurd, it better serve someone's drive and motivations and what they care about and their character, because, even if it can be a heightened reality, but it needs to have a grounded core, I think is, is really what I have.

Absorbed from them from Tina and Robert over the years and, applied to the show as much as I can.

Lorien: Always character character. Yeah, everything.

Meredith: Yeah.

Lorien: Okay. So I could talk to you for 100 more years, but same. I want I we didn't even really get into talking about the show, which I really want to do, but.

I think we're out of time. We'll have you back if you want to talk specifically about the show a bit more because I'm curious about casting and like how that all worked out and the difference between the pilot and the cast and all that kind of stuff. Okay, one last question.

Meredith: Do you want to do lightning round?

We could do a lightning round. And I really want to know.

Lorien: So you wrote this, you wrote the You got picked up, see it's in order, you write the pilot, you write all that. When did casting come into play, and how did that change your script, or did you have casting in mind when you wrote it?

Meredith: So, we sold it, the room op no, the room had not opened.

When the room opened, I had attached Sara Bareilles. Mm. She was that just a phone call.

Lorien: You were like, Hello, Broadway.

Meredith: I just brought it. There's a hotline phone for Broadway. I picked it up. Sarah was on the other line. I was like, Oh my God, it was perfect. I want to talk to you. Yeah, no, Tina.

That's when Tina Fey becomes quite helpful. Also, it was Tina's idea for Sarah. I had all these characters and I didn't, have an exact dawn in mind. And she was like, who feels really right for this is Sarah Bareilles. She's I saw her in Waitress. She was great. And and then I watched her do the Tony's, co host the Tony's with Josh Groban.

And she was really effortlessly funny. It's a real natural. And so Tina's like, why don't we try and do it? So Tina zoomed with her and then I jumped on and this was literally the height of the pandemic. And she was kind of like, she had read the script and she said, yes. And she was like, I'm scared of this, which is exciting to me.

So, so she said yes. And then we slowly started entering the audition process for the other characters, but also kind of meeting with It's different people that we would maybe offer it to Renee was the next person that we met with who we thought would be an amazing wiki. Tina had worked with her on sisters and said she was really funny.

A lot of people don't know how funny she is. And I had seen her on documentary now co op episodes and I was like.

Jeff: Incredible episode of TV.

Meredith: Yeah. So funny. She was so committed. I was like, Oh my gosh, if this lady commits to this character, there's no telling you How great it would be. So, and she said yes.

And so we had Renee attached. And so the, and then we were like, we were going through casting for the other two roles. And because of the pandemic, both busy and Paula were on the East coast and they were two people that I had thought of for the show, but I did not think they would be part of this because they lived in LA and, we were going to shoot on the East coast.

I didn't know if they'd want to uproot their lives. And Tina was like, they're here. Why don't I just call them? Tina really put the, put the cast together. She, she was, she's an incredible casting instinct. And, and people answer her phone calls more than mine. So, then, but that was, we were in the writer's room writing the script.

Some stuff that, before we had actors attached. So, it, that first table read was really interesting because you're hearing how people would perform things. And you, I don't totally know all of Renee's comedic moves. I remember listening to her in the table read. And there was one line where she had to burst into song in the middle, in a show offy way, in the middle of the line.

And she, it was lights out so funny. Okay, this is something we need to like, this is a spice in our, Cabinet that we must use. And we try not to overdo it, but she's so funny. She's so funny.

Lorien: The show is so wickedly funny. I love it so much.

Meredith: And then it did change. It did change how we approach the music a little bit because I thought that we would worst case just get actresses that couldn't really sing but we're funny.

And then we ended up getting these like black belt singers. And so. It was incredible because it really makes you root for them more. And and it, and allowed us like, then we started playing around with making the full versions of some of the songs that we'd play in credits and then and Sarah was has been kind enough every season to write us a song that for, cause her character's arc is like going from, she was like a tossed, she had songwriting ambitions in the old days, but was very much like.

Please, we have a Swedish guy for this. You don't need to do anything. Put your notebook away. And and so her finding her voice as the group's songwriter, and then she, wrote some of these new beautiful songs for Girls by Love, like 2. 0, are really wonderful and can make you cry. So there's a lot of stupid songs and then her songs are incredibly beautiful.

Lorien: One of my favorite moments is Tina Fey as Dolly Parton. Oh yeah. That just slayed me on so many levels.

Meredith: Tina would do this little recalibration between takes. Which I won't do well, but she would just go, Yawn and stretch, and just try to That would get her in the, in the mind, the voice of Dolly.

She's an incredible mimic. She can, she really can Do people, do voices incredibly well. So fun. We, we did go out to the real Dolly and never heard back. We, initially, and Tina played her during the table read, And then Peacock was like, Can Tina do it, please? We're like, well, we never heard back from Dolly.

Tina was willing to be in that costume all day. She was a real hero.

Lorien: That's awesome. All right. Well, it has been a joy talking to you about comedy and your career. And we ask our guests the same three questions. And so the first one is what brings you the most joy when it comes to writing?

Meredith: A bit that, makes you die laughing in the writer's room is when I am like, this is, I had loved my job. It's the greatest. So that's my favorite.

Lorien: And what pisses you off about being a writer or your writing? Pisses me off?

Meredith: It's a wild career and you have to have a little bit of faith in the unknown of the future.

I think that's one of the things, Gloria, Gloria's character, after she got spit out by the business just was like, what's the most practical thing I know won't go away teeth. So there's just this, so she became a dentist. So, with the dream stuff like when you're doing something.

Like this, which is a real gift to be able to do. I, I, you just never know what the. what's coming for what's coming down the pipe. So the unknown I think is a little bit freaky.

Jeff: I will say that was a pretty good Paula Pell. I know you're a good go back and listen. I think you'll be like, Oh!

Meredith: Wait, you know what? I I end up doing them a lot. Well, we pitch, when we pitch, we often pitch in their voices. I bet. And then also when I'm in post, I do a lot of a DR in their voices. So , I, the, the one I really can't do is dawn, I, I can't do her.

Jeff: Yeah.

Meredith: Summer. Summer I can do.

Jeff: That's good. It helps when you're writing too. Sometimes if you're trying to think of a joke, like especially in comedy sometimes, like saying it out loud or trying to get your mouth around it can be helpful. I find.

Meredith: It is. Yeah. I agree.

Jeff: Well, our last question, Meredith, is if you could go back and have a coffee with your younger self what advice would you give to that Meredith?

I guess it would be, don't don't let her say, pick your brain would probably be the advice.

Lorien: Yeah. I would say anyone on the throat who says pick your brain.

Meredith: This is going to sound like another greeting card. I was going to say, ask for what you want. Like I, I think sometimes. I thought it was obvious I would move up or be the next in line or whatever.

And when I wasn't, it was shocking. And then, but I don't know that I projected it as much or, or whatever. Don't know. I, I, I would just, Huh. What would I tell her? I guess I would tell her to do some breathing exercises for anxiety.

Lorien: That's legit.

Meredith: Belly breathing is very helpful.

Lorien: That's that's very practical.

Meredith: Yeah.

Lorien: Yes.

Meredith: Wear sunscreen. What else? These are things you can still tell yourself now. Breathe in. Invest. Buy an apartment. You idiot. You still rent. All you own still are laptops. What is wrong with you?

Lorien: Well, we know that you're looking for the double sink in your.

Meredith: I know, twin sinks. Twin sinks. Twin sinks.

Lorien: Yeah.

Meredith: One day.

Lorien: One day. Well, it has been amazing talking to you and I've really loved getting to know you and hear all your stories and your perspective. So thank you.

Meredith: Thank you for having me. This is delightful.

Jeff: Thanks

Meredith: Meredith.

Lorien: Thank you so much to Meredith for joining us today and thank you so much to you for tuning into The Screenwriting Life.

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